Rasengan or Chidori?


ok, so Ryan (renzy10) here on my first post. There was a debate on why hell realm was still alive after Kono pwned him with rasengan, and I’ve noticed that the rasengan never really kills anyone by itself. jjjjjjj gets credit for thinking up the topic, but… 

Which is stronger, rasengan or chidori?

We already know that they are two totally different attacks; one uses purely nature manipulation, while the other is all shape manipulation.  Sasuke was able to learn the chidori relatively fast seeing as how he needed to learn nature manipulation, but people sometimes forget that he is already capable of doing this with his fire attacks.  This is much different compared to how Naruto learned rasengan, he ended up finding his own way of using it whereas Sasuke was just given a set of instructions and he was able to follow them. So basically, due to prior experience with nature manipulation, it was easier for Sasuke to learn chidori than it was for Naruto to learn his rasengan. Naruto still learned this jutsu pretty fast, he worked extremely hard to perfect it, even if he is a touch slow.

You can make the argument that chidori was an incomplete jutsu without the sharingan, but the rasengan is also considered incomplete.  In the gaiden issues, we see Kakashi using his chidori for the first time, but because the attack speed is so high it is almost impossible to read a counter. That is why the sharingan is necessary for this jutsu to work, in a way it slows things down for the user so they can avoid a counter attack. The rasengan itself can work as a jutsu, but it is still deemed as incomplete because it is lacking nature manipulation. The fourth hokage created the jutsu with full intentions of adding nature manipulation to the mix, but as seen, he was unsuccessful and Naruto had to find a way to complete it on his own. This seems to be a theme, Naruto for being so dumb is still able to think up ways to complete jutsus.

You also have to look at the requirements for the jutsu, anyone can learn the rasengan really, you just need to have enough chakra. Kakashi was able to copy the rasengan with his sharingan, and given that he IS a genius, he still doesnt really have that much chakra compared to Naruto or J-Man. For that matter, I don’t believe he has anywhere near as much chakra as Sasuke. This being said, I think Sasuke could easily learn the rasengan (maybe rasengan in one hand and chidori in the other…. how badass could that be?). The chidori on the otherhand requires an affinity for lightning chakra manipulation, this means it is impossible for Naruto to learn it unless his second element ends up being lightning, which i dont think will be the case. 

This clip shows the two attacks against eachother, and Kakashi is astonished that Naruto can actually use the rasengan. Initially with the two water towers it looks like Sasuke’s chidori is head over heals better than Naruto’s rasengan, but at the end you can see Sasuke looks almost scared of Naruto because of the back of the water tower, but is this showing that Naruto’s rasengan is stronger? or is it showing Sasuke’s amazement at Naruto’s progress?

As you see here the collision of the two attacks releases some pretty insane energy.  Sasuke ends up winning, but you really can’t draw too many conclusions from this. We know using the fox’s chakra basically takes everything out of Naruto, so you can’t be sure if the attacks cancel or if Sasuke actually defeated Naruto.  So was this a victory for Sasuke’s chidori? Or was it the fox chakra? Sasuke was pretty beat up, but he was able to walk away. Also it was an intense battle, both Sasuke and Naruto used a lot of chakra, it is very possible that Naruto’s rasengan had no affect on Sasuke. One thing thats true, is that Sasuke looks like the biggest flamer when he uses his cursed seal. 😀






– Space

– Nature (lightning)

Unique Traits:

– Very compact with insane rotation

– Crazy speed creates a screeching noise


– Yondaime Hokage

– Hatake Kakashi

Current Users:

– Jiraiya, Kakashi, Naruto, Konohamaru

– Kakashi, Sasuke

Kill Rate:

– Has not killed anyone to date

– Used by Kakashi to kill countless enemies

Notable facts:

– Incomplete Jutsu
– Wind has now been added

– Completed only if user has a sharingan

– Speed required to deliver






– high levels of chakra

– speed



– affinity for lightning elemental recomposition

So, who is the real winner? Sasuke or Naruto?

Thanks go out to Ibiki Teishi for some editing and the badass table 🙂



~ by renzy10 on January 26, 2009.

213 Responses to “Rasengan or Chidori?”

  1. holy mother of Naruto, i’m freekin’ FIIIIIRRRRRRRSTSTTTTTTT

    awesome post Renzy. 😉

  2. second

  3. Well Done Renzy!

  4. So Renzy did I miss your opinion on which is stronger or did you leave it for the reader to decide?

  5. hey im near the top yay (smiles like a weirdo)

  6. Whatever happened to robot jones, I mean Bono.

  7. I’d say Rasengan wins, hand down. Now that it’s complete, Naruto would totally pwn Sasuke if they only battled each other with those two jutsu. LOL And even if Naruto was only able to use the incomplete form of Rasengan, I think it has more destructive power behind it as you mentioned before with the water towers. It’s like the comparison being made a while ago (during the Rasengan debate) about a regular gun versus a shotgun … Chidori acts more like a regular bullet with its piercing, straight through the body motion – Rasengan, on the other hand, strikes me as being more like a shotgun, with a widespread, expanding attack. That’s my two cents anyway 🙂

  8. well, an air element thats highly condenced and exreamly fast spinning, that sounds like something approching a big ball of plasma to me. that may not be their intent when it was written, but if it ever hit a crittical level thats what it would be. and as we all know plasma is so hot and carries a strong magnetic charge. it would be a pure repulser in a head to head (maybe thats why they blew eachother back in the vally of the end) with chidori. which would leave the physical strength of the weilders to decide the outcome. however in the more common veiw of rasengan i dont think thats the intent.

  9. oh and i like cheese

  10. eh…..nothing new here. No strong opinion/no new insight/not enough thought provoking statements. Sorry Renzy

  11. JHall: I do believe the point was for you and the other readers to take the known information, which Renzy was kind enough to compile and review, then you were to contribute your insightful speculation and duke it out with the other readers. The heading on the post was ‘which is stronger, chidori or rasengan?’

    But I suppose you missed that bit. Good thing I’m here to help you learn how to read. Let me know when you’re ready for another lesson.

  12. Well, thanks for the insult Ibiki. I just don’t think it the post is up to par compared to what the other writers here at iareawesomeness post. I guess its not a must, but it doesn’t seem college lvl. Why settle with less when you guys are so much better than the rest? I figured it was one of the applicants for the new blog job. Maybe the kid will do better next time. I am unbias. I didn’t enter or don’t know anyone that did (personally). Didn’t intend rudeness, only critism. Its a shame you took a swing at me Ibiki, I tend to like your stuff.

  13. scratch that “it” in the second sentence…..I am not a good writer in my own right.

  14. JHall: I took a swing at you because you took a swing at a new writer without, by the nature of your comments, stopping to really understand the post. That’s not right, and I tend to speak up to that kind of ‘criticism.’

    And…hold up there, punkin, what makes you such an expert about college level writing? And…when was that a requirement on a site (if I may quote Jeremiah) called ‘i are awesomeness’?! Yeah. I might just quote him again here, ‘thanks, mom.’

  15. And still with the hostility after an obvious submission, lol. Ok. I’m working on my masters, albeit in Electrical Engineering. I’ve had more than enough experience with college lvl papers. Its a mute point though.

    I made the acknowledgement in the previous post that I realized it wasn’t a requirement, but again, why settle for less, doll? Why are you on edge? Not that I don’t enjoy grappling around in the mud about it.

  16. i like cheese!!!

  17. Oh man, so anxious to get in the last word, huh? Look, you’re entitled to your opinion, and you’re even allowed to take the piss out of people around here…if they deserve it. Master’s, huh? I see. Come back when you major professor explains the difference between moot and mute. If you’re going to critique the ‘writing’, I’d suggest you proof your own stuff. BTW, does your prof know you’re not currently working right now?

  18. My last line was actually a second attempt to lighten your mood. Moot, mute, same thing. I said I was EE not a spelling bee champ. You’re turning the subject to me. If we’re going to keep rolling around, lets at least keep it on the mat.

    I’ve actually gotten what I wanted out of one little snid bit in that last comment though: “Look, you’re entitled to your opinion, and you’re even allowed to take the piss out of people around here…if they deserve it.” Thank you. My original comment was overly aggressive anyways.

    You seem like a well spoken undergrad, btw. Take no offense (I’m not far out of undergrad myself)

  19. oh, also, you’re thinking of a PH.D. You’re masters isn’t quite as much of a slave job.

  20. oh no not a debate on, “THAT JUTSU” lol sorry i just wanted to put a lame joke down, oh nodoes that make me lame… (ahhh im getting depressed about myself now) jk i like me. im great.

    and as i said in my post above, rasengan lays a smack down on chidori. then it stands over top and is like “what punk u dont want none, you got nuffin” then rasengan picks chidori up and says hold on to my pocket and follow me around you is mine now. and chidori is all emasculated and cant say anything because the almost plasma ball rasengan punked him out! true story i heard it from a guy who knew a guy who totally saw it happen!

  21. “I’m not far out of undergrad myself” Obviously. But I’m sure the course load of frosh comp that 1st semester EE students have to carry at your institution is just unbearable. We really shouldn’t keep you. And, you aren’t that busy with your master’s? Oh…well…awkward. Um. No shame, tho, man. I guess we can’t all go to top tier universities.

    Look, I’m going to point out that _you_ are swinging at me. And if you want to keep swinging, I’m happy to keep capping on you.

  22. ahhhh why cant i post, its making me angry stupid govi’ comps

  23. ahhh i cant post and its pissing me off stupid govi’ comps’

  24. haha two big balls knocking into eachother thats funny

  25. haha two big balls knocking into eachother thats funny

  26. wow calm down both of you… no need for the hatin’… jhall this isn’t suppose to be college level writing, some of us like me aren’t in college yet and this is suppose to be a debate like forum… and ibi no need to jump on jhall for a little criticism that he felt was needed, he’s entitled to his opinion and i’m sure that was all he was going to say. As long as he doesn’t blast renzy i see no trouble in what he said. As of note i’m kinda disappointed in the way both of you reacted and though i find your pissing match hilarious, i think it needs to stop so we can get back to the original point of this post.

    as of my opinion: nice job renzy, and way to finally join the posting world after contributing a lot to our comments section.

  27. OK, I have a few thought to throw into this melting pot.

    Has Sasuke improved upon the original chidori created by Kakashi?

    What is Chidori composed of; it is more that just Nature recomposition. There is a low level shape manipulation jutsu added to it to keep the shape dense and compacted in the palm of the hand. Later Sasuke matures the shape manipulation used with this to extend into a lightning saber. I still believe this is his original chidori with enhanced shape manipulation added to extend the reach.

    Evolution of Chidori links are below

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/113/08/ (First Battle use)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/227/03/ (Chidori vs Rasengan = a tie)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/232/15/ (Awakened Chidori vs Rasengan = Draw)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/343/15/ (Chidori with shape manipulation)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/344/001/ (Chidori with shape manipulation)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/358/15/ (Chidori with shape manipulation)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/385/10-11/ (Chidori with shape manipulation)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/415/05/ (Chidori with shape manipulation)


    Naruto has done the exact same thing with Rasengan.

    Evolution of Rasengan links are below

    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/167/04/ (Original)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/260/10-11/ (Upgraded to Oodama Rasengan)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/322/07/ (The addition of wind begins)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/340/001/ (Rasengan Shuriken beta)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/431/10/ (Giant Rasengan)
    http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/432/06-07/ (Rasengan Shuriken perfected)

    So both of our two characters have taken their specialized jutsu to fairly extreme levels, however Naruto has the clear advantage. Rasengan is currently the highest known level of shape recomposition and he is adding basic nature recomposition to this. to produce highly destructive S-ranked jutsu. He will be able to add any of the 5 elements to this to create unique jutsu.

    Sasuke is at the opposite side of the spectrum, using a very high level lightning nature recomposition and adding basic shape manipulation to it. This is his second element, but even if he learns additional elements his shape manipulation is only at a moderate level and falls far behind Rasengans ranking. If his Shape manipulation skills continue to grow, the original chidori we watched him grow up with will morph into other powerful S-Ranked jutsu potentially getting near the power of Rasen Shuriken.

  28. lol, well said Alec. It was all in good fun. I was honestly enjoying it, as I’m sure she was too. I love Ibiki. Plain and simple. This is the begining of a beautiful relationship.

    PS I took no swing at you, hoss. 😉

    Eh, rasengan vs chidori? Chirdori all day at base level. All bets are off past that. Rasengan has the unique ability to be crafted into the users chosen element(s), assuming the user CAN do this (no one other than Naruto so far).

  29. Jeremiah… Help I wrote a big, awesome reply to this and it will not post. Check your e-mail.

  30. Alec, bullying doesn’t sit well with me. And this was a bully’s attack. I have no problem with criticism fairly rendered, and he is entitled to his opinion. But his comment, as it was constructed, was a power play designed to tear down a first time poster, and had nothing to do with the actual post at all. It wasn’t just criticism.

    I’m glad it was entertaining, I did try to at least make it funny. Although, I’m sorry if my tactics bothered you or anyone else.

  31. Thanks for saying something, Orion. I got it. You went to spam for all those links. (O.o) awesomeness….

  32. I really had no other motive. No bullying intended. Bother me? I think I’m in love, actually

  33. Aight enough. No more from either of you or I’ll sick Erich on both of you!


    Don’t make me turn this car around! LMAO 😛

  34. Awwwww….jeeez, dad….

  35. YES!!!! Big Daddy Jeremiah’s back!!!!

  36. But PA,you promised you’d take me to see the Braves game!

  37. @ Alec – Cause I got a text saying there was a flameout occurring in the new post!


  38. I liked the breakdown section. I geek out over stats and comparison charts.

  39. lol, good times, good times… i’ve been around this place way to long, haven’t I?

  40. Between this and lab reports, this is how I spend my nights…..flaming out. haha. This blog is connected! haha.

  41. haha its really all ok im a high school kid anyways im not expected to produce college level stuff 😛

    also i need criticism its what keeps people grounded

  42. also orion thats pure awesomeness haha

  43. Thats the spirit Renzy. I might write something soon, and you can tear into me for my lack of ability to write at my own standard. haha.

  44. haha yea…. thanks for sticking up for me though ibi 🙂

  45. @ Alec – way too long? Like I said to you six months ago my friend, this is only the beginning.

  46. Anytime, Z.

  47. ok there is no way chidori is more powerful thn rasengan in the last fight. sasuke cheated he hit naruto in the gut and as we see in previous shows that can knock a person unconscious. could it be that sasuke recognized he was losing so he hit naruto in the gut. and naruto couldnt even fight back he swung the dead arm and all it did was scratch the headband so i doubt that chidori is stronger.

  48. wow sorry my comp went into a glitch-tastic mode last night, not sure why the reposts of stuff

  49. @lich king – I do not believe Naruto ever had the intent to seriously injure or Kill Sasuke. Before the fight ever began Sasuke told Naruto that he was so far beneath him that Naruto could not even put a scratch on Sasuke’s headband. In Naruto’s final finishing move he scratched Sasuke’s headband to prove himself. Where some people see Naruto being defeated, I see naruto accomplishing what Sasuke stated he was incapable of doing.

    Additionally to get this derailed post back on track, I want to hear some thoughts on the evolution of the aforementioned Jutsu this post is about. Do you guys believe the original Jutsu they started with are being modified to become stronger as our characters grow up?

    Look through the links above and see if you guys come to an alternate conclusion than I did about Chidori becoming Sasuke’s basis for his current Chidori saber.

    I have a good feeling these two jutsu will be the foundation for other creations Naruto and Sasuke wield, each one becoming more powerful that the previous version.

  50. i agree orian, id like to see naruto add a different element to rasengan. not going to happen anytime soon and to be honest i dont think anything would mesh as well with rasengan as wind. water rasen just doesnt have the same ring to it and i dont see them givving naruto a fire abulity however that whould be one bad mamma-jamma fire rasen…?… that sounds like it would set a forest or 2 ablaze. more likely naruto will push his wind formation to the max. it could be a much different jutsu that is visually simmilar but could be self propeled, have a property that makes it “seem lighter” to the user any one of a hundred things. as far as chidori shape manipulation extendable or sharper seems to be the best fit. as of chapter 433 i would give it to rasengan head to head having more power. but thats not fair to chidori because one of the most important aspects is the speed and tactics of the attack.

    conclusion: chapter 433 rasengan head on. naruto in sage mode also takes it via the extra factors i mentioned. he may not be faster than sausgay but has at least enough speed and power to efectivly counter it.

  51. @ lich king – I actually think that Naruto only wanted to put a scratch on Sasuke’s head band, I don’t think he wanted to hurt him with that last shot.

    Sasuke had said that he couldn’t do that and later it shows Sasuke look at his head band and realize what Naruto did. It’s very subtle.

    He was going for blood this whole time and Naruto was not. I think that’s why Sasuke spared his life at the end because he realized that after he saw the mark on his head band and recognized Naruto. But at the same time it also confirmed that in order to accomplish his goal of killing Itachi he had to leave the village. He didn’t want to be surrounded by people that wouldn’t be out for blood. He needed to be surrounded by hate and a willingness to kill at anymoment in cold blood for no reason. Oro provided that.

    I also say surrounded by all of this but I don’t say completely become that. Oro comments on how he never kills his training partners who are captives in Oro’s molester lair. So I’d say that he accomplished his goal by being surrounded by it but never became that.

    I’ve now rambled so much that I’ve forgotten my original point…

  52. I agree with Jeremiah and Orion about the scratch. I think that whole fight was draw, but more because of the participants than the strength of the jutsu.

    Sasuke has done some really cool things with Chidori if you follow the anime–I’ve got a gif file if I can figure out how to post it. He’s turned it into a mid-range attack, at least. And neither the manga or the anime showed just how he defeated Oro’s ‘1,000 men’ but it seems like he’d need a long range attack as well.

  53. here’s the clip: http://ibikiteishi.wordpress.com/files/2008/12/naruto-s89-1.gif

  54. sasuke is becoming victor von doom haha

  55. im not sure if im right but i wanted to point out what i thought was a big mistake. rasengan is a jutsu which uses only spatially recomposed chakra which is basically spinning the chakra so fast that it becomes compressed and can do great damage. wheras chidori is made of spatial and physical recomposition. its spatially recomposed to create chakra capable of cutting and then physicaly recomposed into lightning which can discharge as physical energy which greatly increases the power. although the spatial power of chidori is nowhere near as much as rasengan. basically even though rasengan is in a lower category than chidori bcos its the most powerful spatial possible its just as powerful. the rasenshuriken should be on the sme level as chidori but bcos its made of a more powerful spatial recomp its much higher level as tht is what determines the strenght of the attack.

    those whoe keep mentioning shape manipulation it has nothing to do with the original chidori its just how sasuke extends the original. he creates chidori and then by increasing the flow of power can stretch it furtherthe same as kakashi does against pain with his dog like chidori.
    hope this helped

  56. grimmjow: I’ve been thinking the spatial/nature manips aren’t quite on target here. 314 page 11, that’s where Kakashi reveals that (according to the current OneManga translation) chidori is: physically recomposed (chakra turned to lightning) and spacially recomposed (this is the trigger that allows discharge and determines the ‘strength and scope of attack’). This is confusing, because in earlier translations (and in the anime, I think?) different terms were used (nature and shape?) At any rate, according to Kakashi chidori requires both–just like fuuton rasen shuriken (the completed jutsu).

  57. yea its because by combining the 2 spatial and physical recomposition the attack becomes 10 times stronger which is obviously the aim

  58. Hmmm….so if chidori has been completed all this time (using physical and spatial recomposition), and it has not bested the incomplete rasengan (no physical recomp or addition of wind)…does that mean the completed chidori is weakass compared to a
    completed rasengan?

  59. the rasenshuriken is basically the strongest attack out there…. shinra tensei would probably be the only acception

  60. Rasengan without a doubt is stronger. Also, the Rasengan is silent unlike the Chidori which means it’s perfect for stealth ops. Well not exactly, the Rasengan produces a lot of light. When you’re in the dark and you need a light, just use Rasengan.

  61. @JHall – Excuse me????u say smfin about being college level??? now i’m still a high school senior…but even then pissing me off a very bad Idea…you are actually implicating that a “kid” can’t write as a good as a post as a “college” bro can? Can it up…

    the rasengan pwns the chidori hands down imo

    rasengan allows for much more flexibility, more mods and is more available to the general public(WTF souunds like an infomercial)

    the chidori is a cool move and all but it wont hols it’s on with a modded rasengan, even the oodam rs would beat it. so it’s just a jutsu for friggin l33ts(not k-dog, he rox) and can’t be done by all

    the chidori is like buying a limited edition mini cooper instead of a full blooded enzo

  62. It’s already been dropped.

  63. thanks for giving me some cred but you made the awsomeness post

    another thing about chidori is you can still use it w/o chakra. like sasuke did on itachi with using the lightning fromn the sky

  64. o and people sense the rasengan easily with chidori kakashi was able to destroy on of kakuza’a hearts within a blink

  65. @harshytkage there is no doubt a modded rasengan can pwn a chidori…. but would you rather have a normal rasengan or the chidori?

    personally chidori by its self wouldnt be effective because it needs the sharingan or else its getting countered, on the other hand the rasengan is so hard to connect with because its so dense and you cant move very fast.

  66. @Nighthawk: here’s a clip of the first use of the rasenshuriken from the anime, the noise level is noted (the fickin happy music is so weenie and disgusting given the destruction, huh?): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHaDDeitwkQ

    @j^n: chidori without chakra? Wasn’t that the first time Kakashi mentioned using too much chakra will kill–when Sasuke was training and trying to do chidori too many times in a row? I don’t understand.

    @Harshy: aw, sorry you were sleeping when I went all kyuubi…although…maybe it was better that you were. @.@

  67. :'(…*sniff*…i always miss out on the good fights…*sob*

  68. @ibi – how is “it” coming along?

  69. LOL, our little bun is baking, Harshy. Order another cigar and I’ll tell you when it’s time. 😉 (BTW, thanks again…)

  70. i’m too wittle too smoke…so i’ll just go to my girlfliends house and have some fun thele….

  71. *puts on Yamato serious face* Harshy just creeped me the F out…


  72. i did some digging around through the archives and gound that you did finish first Jeremiah


    the post is pretty old so *cough cough* it’s got some internet dust, buu you did finish first in this one…

  73. *but not buu

  74. i’m bwack…what did u wittle guys do widout me???
    my gf wasn’t home sso i left her a message 😉

    (Holy shit, she’s on the phone and she’s tellin me to get the f*ck of my PC or else…O.o)

  75. Based on the new spoilers, I’m going to go out on a limb and say I think plain ol’ rasengan just took its first life, if you can’t the various bodies of Pein to be alive.

  76. @ Alec (AKA Captain Maniac LOL!) – OMG that’s old >_<

    We’ve come so far as a blog, havn’t we?

    What happened to Cdog? He was a great commentor.

    I also like how certain I am that Kushina is the new body of Pain ^_^

    Seems like years ago!

  77. im sorry buh huwever said tht the rasengan produces lots of light is pure dumb. no becos of tht buh bcos are usayin tht a lighning attack chidori doesnt loool

  78. @ Ibiki
    Sorry for just randomly popping up
    but i think that guy was talking about when sasuke used the lighting to use the chidori against itachi

    he created the clouds with the ameratsu and the fire jutsu to make storm clouds?

    ermmm the link isss.
    read from there till he uses the thunder ;D

  79. @ibiki: I’m talking about the Rasengan not the Rasenshuriken ^^

  80. they both give off light… both attacks are pure energy, so theres light, heat, etc.

    also @jhall double rasengans kick ass

  81. about the Rasengan vs. Chidori which happened in the valley of the end. Neither of them got hurt that much. The only reason Naruto can’t fight after it is becuase Sasuke went in for a powerful punch, doing loads of damage, whereas Naruto only decided to scratch Sasuke’s forehead, proving that he was the better ninja between the two.

  82. @Nighthawk: ok. but isn’t comparing Rasengan to Chidori like comparing apples and oranges? I mean, completed jutsu to completed jutsu seems like a better discussion to me…more like granny smiths to red delicious. But…maybe that’s just me.

  83. @ elasticatedninja – exactly! He didn’t want to deliver a death blow like Sasuke did. Two totally different mentalities in that fight. It’s alot harder to capture than kill.

  84. You know I think that narutos second element has to be water. Think about it, narutos wind rasengan is very strong, if it hits someone they are dead. Naruto is a ninja that has never killed a real person yet and I dont think he would want to kill Sasuke. So the best thing for him to do is make a non-lethal rasengan with water or ice.

  85. hmm. I guess I see the end of the VOTE (valley of the end) battle differently (manga 233). I think both Sasuke and Naruto were going in for the kill, completely out of their heads at that point, and at the last second, both realized what they were doing. I base that on Kakashi’s statement about the chakra when he’s still a long way off “this chakra is terrible”.

    I really don’t think Sasuke could kill Naruto, no matter how he said that’s what he was doing. I think Naruto lost himself enough to try. And when they got close enough, and really realized it, they both pulled their punches–and clasped fingers as all that bullshit dropped away.

    Naruto passed out from the Kyuubi use, it burned him inside. So when he shut off the desire to attack, his body just collapsed. Sasuke’s curse had him spitting blood, but the reaction was more delayed. He may have walked away, but he probably passed out right outside the valley.

  86. elfaron naruto can’t use resenshuriken it hurts his hand but sasuke doesn’t have curse anymore cause of tobi but sasuke can still put chidori in his sword

  87. I also agree with ibiki teishi nut i still think sasuke would kill naruto he almost cut him in half in shippuden

  88. @L naruto can throw his rasenshuriken now… we saw it in the last manga, so it doesnt do damage to him this way. also itachi was the one who got rid of sasukes cs.

    naruto and sasuke have both come a long way since we saw them at oros hideout…. i would love to see them fight now 🙂

  89. i think naruto’s sage mode would put him on an even playing field with sasuke, if not even higher. if eight tails could pwn him, then naruto could do some pretty hardxcore damage.

    plus, since he can throw the rasenshuriken now, sasuke would have to step up his game by making the chidori maybe a full-body thing, or at least be able to direct it to a certain location.

  90. I don’t think Sasuke would stand a chance against Naruto at his current level. It’s another reason I think a time skip is coming. I don’t see anything on the horizon that would change that uneven playing field. It would be another story all together if he had gotten the 8 tailed beast…

  91. @ Jeremiah – what do you think would put sasuke on an equal level to naruto?

  92. Getting one of the tailed beasts from Akatsuki wouldn’t have hurt.

  93. Also, I would think learning from an Uchiha master like Madara would probably be something he should think of taking advantage of like he did with Oro. But he seems so damn hostile toward him I seriously doubt that its possible.

  94. like i said earlier, i’d like to see sasuke manipulate it to certain locations or all over his body. that would be hardxcore to the max. power level over 9000 anybody?

  95. The one advantage that Sasuke would have in a battle with naruto RIGHT now would be that goddamned sharingan of his… If he could get as good as his brother with the sharingan he would be relatively close to naruto

  96. hm.. i’m not sure. naruto has his sage mode now, plus his back up of the kyuubi if that fails. not to mention the little surprise itachi gave him that we have yet to see. at this point, i think naruto has a great advantage over sasuke..

  97. i think that sausgay is on narutos level, hurts to say but sharingan + speed + mulitiple jutsu selection + tactics = a great matchup against cleaver + tank + power hitting jutsu + stamina as seems to be the theme between then naruto would have to rely on his abulity to outlast sausgay so to speek. sage mode brings alot to narutos side but sauske still stacks up to put at least a good bit of smackdown

  98. but naruto is trying not to use the kyubbi since he hurt sakura with it and sage mode isnt permanent. People are also forgetting that sasuke has the sharingan with powers like the ameratsu. Remember what the ameratsu did to the 8-tails??

  99. sauske stacks up well against naruto even in sage mode. sharingan + speed + multiple jutsu + tactics vs tank like stamina + cleverness + hard hitting jutsu + on heck of a hard chin (boy can take a punch) = sausgay being able to put a hurting on naruto w and wo the ms jutsus. meaning naruto, as is offten the case would need to outlast sausgay and grind him into the ground. as ebisu explaind way way back, naruto can produce more clones but it takes him (made up number) 1.5 times the chakura to do it. meaning the tool is still a pretty big bad ass against naruto and the last round of the fight will be the decider

  100. hi friends,
    this is my answer to Rasengan or Chidori debate.


    from all this i think kakashi only said that sasuke would have killed naruto with that chidori but in actual rasengan is so strong that while talking with j-man kakashi said that in the worst scene naruto would have killed sasuke.lol.so rasengan is the stronger.

  101. http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/176/08/

    from all this i can say that kakashi only said that sasuke would have killed naruto with that chidori but in actual while talking with j-man kakashi said that rasengan would have killed sasuke.lol.so rasengan is strong.

  102. @Jeremiah: he was pretty hostile to Oro, too, tho. I think Madara’s going to be his next “master.”

  103. yes, but even so, naruto just _might_ be able to control the kyuubi better through whatever itachi gave him, or will tell the others to leave the area, or something along those lines. the kyuubi has to come out somehow, it’s part of naruto and the basis for the series.

    it’s basically the hero always prevails synopsis. take dragonball z for example.. goku always came out on top, even when it seemed hopeless. do you see my point?

  104. @ ibi – i think that could be possible.. but do you think it would be more of a ‘last resort’ type of situation..? i really dont see sasuke trusting madara without a vast amount of persuasion..

  105. oh… im not saying naruto wouldnt win… im just saying that sasuke is more evenly matched than you and Jeremiah give him credit for… i want naruto to win all the way…

  106. and i think the kyuubi will come out at times… just not in the fight vs sasuke

  107. see.. i don’t know.. i’m thinkin that when they do fight, it’ll be like the ultimate rematch, and eventually the kyuubi will come out, whether naruto is willing to let it out or not

  108. but then again, naruto’s been saying all this stuff about how HE wants to get stronger so he can bring sasuke back on HIS own power… what would be the point of him doing all this training if he just brings out the kyuubi to fight sasuke in the end anyways??

    i get what your saying about the “ultimate battle” but i think it would be alot better without the kyuubi.

    then again… knowing kishi you dont really know what the f*** is going to happen.. he has already destroyed konoha, put kakashi and tsunade’s life in jeopardy, and thrown naruto in a 1v1 with the akatsuki leader.. and this is all in the last 12 chapters!!!!!

  109. oh, and he brought the swayze in… dont know if you noticed that.. or maybe it was just the way the light hit the page.. i thought i saw a ghost. ha. man i’m lame..

    i kindof agree.. i’d like to see him go most of the battle not using it and then BAM he can control that shit. that would put a smile on my face haha

  110. why the hell do i have to be so new… im still trying to get used to all these damn swayze / captain planet jokes.
    oh well im sure i’ll get used to them soon enough

  111. @amongst: training with someone doesn’t mean you trust them, sadly, it just means you need their knowledge and are willing to do just about anything to get it. I think that’s the way Sasuke sees it, and it’s another reason I feel bad for him. Sure, it was his choice to go, but at 13 did he really know what he was doing?

    oh, and L: Sasuke at VOTE is three years different from Sasuke of Shippuden. He probably could kill Naruto, might even really want to. Now it would be a pragmatic choice to keep Naruto from preventing of fulfilling his plans. Sasuke seems to be a very pragmatic/prectical student of Machivelli (the ends justify the means).

  112. @ ibi – good point, he just wanted the ability to kill his brother, and oro had that for him. now he’s up to the next level, and madara has the capability to give him even greater strength, so he’s obviously the next choice of ‘master’
    that makes alot of sense. thanks 🙂

  113. Rasengan!!! Just wanted to put my two cents in. Done post! ;p

  114. sauske stacks up well against naruto even in sage mode. sharingan + speed + multiple jutsu + tactics vs tank like stamina + cleverness + hard hitting jutsu + on heck of a hard chin (boy can take a punch) = sausgay being able to put a hurting on naruto w and wo the ms jutsus. meaning naruto, as is offten the case would need to outlast sausgay and grind him into the ground. as ebisu explaind way way back, naruto can produce more clones but it takes him (made up number) 1.5 times the chakura to do it. meaning the tool is still a pretty big bad ass against naruto and the last round of the fight will be the decider

  115. i think sasuke will need to see narutos strength, and know its superior to his before he trains with madara

  116. hmmm….good point Renzy. Now you’ve got me thinking, and I might as well do it out loud.

    Wasn’t Sasuke on his way to Konoha a few issues back? I really don’t think he’s going to show himself here, it’s not time for a Naruto v. Sasuke or even for a team effort. (First Sasuke has to see Naruto’s strength, as you put it, you’re so right.) BUT, I do think Sasuke is going to catch some of the battle, or enough of the aftermath to have a few lights go on.

    My guess is: he’s going to see or learn what happened and figure out he really doesn’t want to destroy Konoha afterall (although he’ll probably put it in emo terms, like, Pain stole my revenge or something similarly cry baby). He’ll also figure out Naruto could kick his bum to heck and back. Both of these things give him a reason to go after even more power.

  117. My guess is that he won’t destroy Konoha because it’s already been destroyed by Pain >_<

    All that’s left is the elders who’d I’d like to see get dead anyway…

  118. LOL. I’m with you on the Elders. I think Kishi’s going to make them even more intolerable here, team them up with Roachzo perhaps? So when Sasuke swoops in to assassinate them, it actually redeems him a bit in the eyes of the fans.

  119. Naruto would kick Sasukes butt especially in sage mode because when they do fight which wont be any time soon hopefully naruto will be able to gain full control over the kyubbi and in which case would cause sasuke to wet his pants and cry back to madara but sasuke will give a good fight especially with mangekyou and a variety of jutsu. But did u see when sasuke faught Killabee he was getting his ass handed to him and killabee was eight tails and not 9-tails like naruto

  120. yea but naruto still has to learn that the fourth was his father, and right now the elders and “roachzo” as you put it are the only ones who know…. unless madara knows hmmmmmm

  121. Wouldn’t Kakashi know too, since he was the 4ths pupil. In which cast Gai, Kuranai, Choji’s dad, and Shikimaru’s dad should also be aware of this since they all are the same age group.

  122. Hell, every adult in Konoha should know that Naruto is the Fourth’s child. I mean how do you hide that your HOKAGE is goona be a DAD?

    Minato: What??? My wifes not pregnant she’s just fat. Hahaha *sweat drop*

    Kushina: *SMACK*

  123. HOLY FLYING BANANA COW!!! Are Ibiki and Harshy having a baby??? *Head Explodes* (But in a funny way).

  124. @supertrek: 1st, I was wondering when someone would notice that smarta$$ery. heh.

    2nd: when Kushina is shown pregnant, Jiraiya reacts strangely. Naruto’s not name Naruto Namizake. Every adult probably knows he’s Kushina’s child, but not necessarily Minato’s son…they may not have been officially married, you know. Soo….

    Good point Renzy…Naruto learning his parentage from Madara…you’re sick. (I love it!)

  125. I don’t think this is the thread for it, but I am realizing something about the writer of Naruto. He has parental issues. Ibiki, let me start this off by saying I mean no offense. I know you recently had a situation with you mother fighting a terminal illness. So if you are extremely sensitive to that do not read further into this.

    Lets take a list of big names in Naruto.

    Naruto – lost both Parents (not sure on Mother)
    Sasuke – lost both parents
    Asuma’s child – Lost his father
    Asuma – Lost his father the 3rd
    Gaara – Lost both parents (Mother at birth, Father to Orochimaru
    Kankuro – Lost both parents (Mother at birth, Father to Orochimaru
    Temari – Lost both parents (Mother at birth, Father to Orochimaru
    Kiba – Dad abandoned them
    Kikashi – Father died
    Rock Lee – Gai is a surrogate father currently, no real parents mentioned
    Shikamaru – Only father is mentioned
    Choji – Father is critically wounded currently
    Orochimaru – Lost both parents
    Neji – Lost his father not sure about mother
    Konohamaru – Seems to have lost his father, Asuma was his Uncle
    Pain/Negato/Yahiko – Orphans
    Yamato – Test tube baby/Clone
    Sakura, Sai, and Tenten are unknown

    Shino has his father, not sure about mother
    Hinata has her father, not sure on mother
    Ino has her father, not sure on mother

    I think Kishi has some parental issues that are coming forward.

  126. I’ve often thought this, orion, but we can’t be sure. In works aimed at young people in particular, loss of parents can be both fantasy (yeah! I could eat ramen every night if I wanted) and very scary (oh…who’s gonna pay for the ramen or clean up the mess…and worse).

    I think Kishi exploits this trope even more because he’s commenting on a world that has seen war after war after war. So on top of the parental hot buttons, I think he may also be commenting on his culture (post WWII Japan which was still in recovery when he was a child). Damn…just got too heavy.

    MMMmmmmmmaiiiiiiiiitoooooooo Gaiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii!!!!!!

  127. @Orion- you’re funny but umm check the facts on konkuro and temari they lost there mother when Gaara was born…

  128. This is a darn good way to convince kids in the ninja world of the dangers of premarital sex. If you get a girl pregnant, Kishi will kill you off, so keep you weeny in your pants.

  129. actaully we’ve seen shikamaru’s mom…

  130. “This is a darn good way to convince kids in the ninja world of the dangers of premarital sex. If you get a girl pregnant, Kishi will kill you off, so keep you weeny in your pants.”

    @orion – ROFLMAO!!!

  131. LOL’g at the pants comment.

    Yeah, Shikamaru’s mom is Yoshino and she’s actually a chuunin in her own right, so don’t you dare leave her off. =)

  132. PArty ahoy!!!


  133. wasnt naruto born basaically in secret? i think everyone was told that kushinas baby died along with her… all just assumption haha

  134. naaaa….sarutobi invented some new fangles jutsu to allow people to look as if they singing celine dion power ballads as they were giving birth, so when naruto was born, all the poeple noticed was a mike being dropped and picked up by the fourth….

  135. i just think it’s strange how absolutely no one makes the connection between naruto and the fourth. are the people of konoha really _that_ shallow that they dont see it? i mean, you think with how smart they are, overrated shikamaru or sakura would guess that. or at least that jiraiya would tell him before he kicked the bucket… he obviously knew with the whole ‘sorry yondaime..’ thing

  136. …again, they may have no idea Minato and Kushina…um…knew each other. I’ll just leave it like that. WTH.

  137. hm.. ibi, what do you mean by ‘knew each other’? please inform me on the matter. *wink*

  138. ewwww monkey hair in my soup

  139. naruto is probely is gonna get his by but kicked by pain cause hes out of sage mode

  140. naruto vs sasuke well it might be taking so lond for sasuke to arrive at leaf cause has traing to but i think naruto might end up having to kill sasuke.

  141. just a quick thought.. tell me if i’m being an r-tard here or if anyone else has mentioned this.. but wouldnt the kyuubi give naruto a fire element manipulation? even though he wasnt born with it, i still think it would be siiiiick if he made RS or mega blue balls rasengan a flaming ball of air *holy noises*
    any comments?

  142. dude im not gunna lie if that actually happens something might go on in my pants haha

  143. …so youre gunna wear undies thereafter..?

  144. ill put some on after…. (note: from now on i will read the new mangas in the nude… incase of an accident)

  145. well, as long as i’ve saved your pants i’m satisfied! ..but you could also wear some pull-ups. *sings* youre a big kid now ..with big (messy) problems.

  146. that prolly beats the alternative haha

  147. and i just thought of something _else_ that makes naruto better than sasugay.. chidori was already a completed jutsu, but rasengan wasnt. mega OWN anyone? i think sasuke epicly fails..

  148. technically yes but the chidori needs a sharingan eye to be completed, without the sharingan it is easily countered, and the sharingan adds a lot to the chidori….

    not saying i disagree though 🙂

  149. ah, very good point renz *golf clap*
    damn i really wanna see naruto add effin fire to the rasengan now. pssh.

  150. the problem i had with fire is it does show his reliance on the kyuubi, his goal is to do things by his own means without help from the fox, if he uses fire techniques it would show that they are connected which defeats the purpose of trying to not utilize the fox’s powers. still though fire + wind into a rasengan would pretty much destroy anything haha

  151. yeah, but burning toad oil would be freekin awesome…careful there, don’t JIYP…
    grape anyone?

  152. yea, but the kyuubi is a part of him either way, i just think he should use it and stop crying about how he doesnt want to. it’s like sasugay not using the sharingan.. yea i know the kyuubi is evil and stuffffff, but… eh. :/

  153. oth of you guys are very right haha

  154. Yo iono if anyone said this but naruto did kinda kill someone with rasengan….that kakazu dude the dude with multiple hearts naruto took out 2 hearts so he did kinda kill him twice

  155. @ grimmbro – he did way more damage than anyone else but Kakashi killed Kakuzu, though its debatable whether he could’ve defeated him with out Naruto’s help.

    You could technically say he “killed” him twice but Kakuzu’s power was to absorb hearts of other nin. So really you were killing the hearts of nin he had absorbed. Naruto pwnd him but Kakashi did the veteran move and curb stomped him at the end.

  156. dang… that means naruto killed the innocent.. oh well, it was great stuff *big grin*

  157. @grimmbro that was the rasenshuriken haha not your normal rasengan with nothing added to it 😛

  158. Kakashi is a dog…a very very COOL dog…

  159. not sure if it’s been said, but he did kill pseudo-Itatchi. rasengan wins, in terms of cones. chidori’s like a drill, cone shape wise. rasengan is a precise tip, that expands out.(shotgun spray. I think it would twist the chidori’s tip just slightly to make it less effective.

  160. rasengan is like what the gun did to bruce willis’ head in the sixth sense

  161. horshy kage i have some news KAKASHI IS DEAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! oh and I like pie naked it helps my thighs


  163. kakashi is _not_ dead *glare*

  164. *single tear rolls slowly down slightly rosy cheek*

  165. Kakashi will laugh in the face of death

  166. yah do u read online pai kills him

  167. sorry pain i forgot to put the n

  168. i do wish he didn’t die he saved choji i’de rather have choji die he sucks

  169. chouji doesnt suck! unless youre talking about food, then he sucks that stuff up left and right cuz he’s a fa-a-hehehe, i mean he’s hungry alot ^^

  170. If you look at the majority votes on this, most people doubt he’s dead, or dead for good. And yes, everyone knows Kakashi got stomped by pein. I bet Kakashi would have done better knowing peins secrete anyways. Choji should have ate lazer head from the get go


  172. then he would of had terrible indigestion

  173. >_< in Every damn fight Kakashi had to protect someone, it kinda sucks but I dont think he is dead for good. Kakashi’s body is not in bad shape and the slug saved it. When the other two died they were stabed in the chest many times, Kakashi had no big holes in him so I dont think he is dead.

  174. haha i have said this several times, in the anime like two weeks ago for no reason they brought it up that when an anbu dies they destroy their body, kakashi’s body is still there, he is not dead!

  175. well wat about wen tsunade saw his body and wen naruto asked were kakshi was?

  176. i had the same argument on a difrent web site wen asuma got killed by hi (friken) dan

  177. wich do u like chidori or resengan? i like chidori

  178. she never said he was dead! though it obviously hints it. I think this is just to build suspense. @renzy, agreed. I think that was an important detail that was easily missed.

  179. wel i am prety sure hes ded he may com back to life and the next chapter is in color

  180. I hav a friend thats nevr herd of shippuden

  181. did u know that the people in japan messed up insted of belive it as naruto catch frase it was sopposed to be get it :~ ( my wierd face)

  182. “-ttebayo,” which is not a well-known ending, has no literal meaning and cannot be translated, but carries the connotations of the speaker being uncultured, brusque, and seeming tougher than they really are.- Naruto wiki

  183. my friend knows fluent japanese and he said it’s basically like saying an exclamation point, like a form of excitement

  184. Ok guyz i have saltaaaaaaar i went to gala club with 2 mpouzoukochikcs and normmally at galla there are only man(snakes) but today when i got in i have goten mounoplaka… i look left chikcs… i look right chicks.. i look up.. chikcs at the celling… i mean TOO MANY WOMEN… and i am soo happy…and then i wen to the bathroom and i snifed some lines of coke…. and then i went down and the dj was playing tsiftetelia(greek lame songs) and at a point dj starts palying armin van buren and i am like saltaaaaaaaarr i mean i am dancing and dancing and i am going to the chicks and dancing and they are dancing to me…. and then the 2 chiks i am with they are saying they are leaving and going to mpouzoukia(like a club playing greek lame soongs with live music) and there are no one familiar to me in the club to stay with and i am like ” fuvk fuckkk” and i went home… this post is out of post but i am so fucking high that i dont fucking care… PEace….

  185. we need to absolutely save punxed comment no matter what it takes!!!!!!

  186. hahaha nice

  187. LMAO! Why does it sound like he just barely avoided being in one of those situations from the movie Hostel… It seemed like he was a bad decision away from being taken to an abandoned building at some secluded location and then tortured to death by a wealthy American on vacation…

    LMFAO! @_@

  188. wealthy american on vacation.. LOL

  189. punxed probably shouldnt be alone right now….

  190. well, he probably _should_ if you know what i mean *wink wink nudge nudge*

  191. hahahhahahahhaha i feel ya

  192. ..wow. i feel violated.

  193. sorry…. im a bit touchy feely 😛

  194. alright, fine. *rips off clothes*
    *does scorpion ‘get over here’ thing*

  195. umm, bad images, really bad images…

  196. ……. ):
    you dont even know what i look like and you judge me?!
    *runs off crying*
    hahaha jk jk

  197. i judge everybody -_-…

  198. that was a little odd… i wont lie. im kinda scared.

  199. i’m seriously crying cuz i’m laughing so hard right now… oh geez..

  200. alec’s as cold as sub zero’s ice

  201. i feel like i should have some kind of smartass remark, but i am too scared to think…..

  202. We need a topic switch here…MMAAAAAIIIIIITTTOOOO GGGAAAAAIIIIII!!!!!!!

  203. there is no point in making a discussion about this whole thing…
    sharingan will overpower rasengan (if sasuGAY isn’t using the cursed seal…and naruto isn’t in tailed stage)
    actually, if the user wants, he doesn’t even need chidori to overpower rasengan….it’ll almost be the same as naruto running towards lee and getting a konoha-senpou and falling unconcious…sharingan will do the trick

  204. “there is no point in making a discussion about this whole thing…”

  205. compared to all of u im new to naruto i have not read the manga and so far im only just getting into naruto shippuden (13th episode or something) but u all forgot something when naruto and sasuke fought at the waterfall place with the 2 statues sasuke punched naruto in the gut during the rasengan-chidori collision making naruto not able to mantain the rasengan probably cause sasuke realized he would have lost and sasuke was mad that his chidori couldnt blast through the water tower but instead did the damage frontwise it wouldnt affect it as deep as sasuke would want it to but at the moment (at least where I am) which is stronger but its probably rasengan

  206. Yeah… thats where you are… I won’t spoil it for you 😀

  207. This topic is so old anon where did you find this topic

  208. sharingan well duh! ME LOVE SASUKE YEAH YEAH YEAH

  209. Wow what an old topic. And this is the first time than I see it. I voted for rasengan.

    Rasengan is way better! (+sage mode) 😀

    even though I thought chidori was stronger,I voted for rasengan.I think chidori is stronger because it’s a lightning element attack while rasengan is wind,this is crucial in attacks since wind element beats lightning but sasuke made it to a draw with naruto,if the elements are not involved,chidori is clearly stronger.

  211. dont forget there was no wind added to the rasengan when it was a draw way back in the day.

  212. at first time the chidori locks more powerful but the rasengan is more powerful because is the only atack that can defeat the chidori the chidori is a lightning atack and in naruto say’s that only the wind defeat the lightning and naruto has a variant of te rasengan of wind and is very powerful loock when naruto defeart pain using that atack

  213. If you see the water tanks, you can see what the author imagine about its powers.
    The chidori has a penetrating power.
    On the other hand, the rasengan has a explosive power. It may not look like much from the outside, but destroys everything in the inside. Kabuto also healed from the outside bruises but after a few steps he falls unable to heal properly from the extensive damages. If Kabuto didn’t have the special jutsu that allowed him to regenerate (like the Cheerleader lol), he would have died instantly (I imagine all his internal organs exploded like a stinky stew).

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